The real reason the BlackBerry Storm doesn’t have Wi-Fi or tri-band HSDPA
You might have guessed it, but the reason is Verizon! We confirmed this a little while back with one of our really top-level sources (you know who you are!) and they did, in fact, confirm our suspicions — Verizon said hell to the no, we don’t play that up in here! Now, before the flamewars start, I will publicly say that although it might not be crystal clear, I love Verizon. Personally, Verizon has the best voice and data network in the US. Did you hear that? I lovez me some VZW.
With that out of the way, it’s pretty clear Verizon’s stance with Wi-Fi, but no tri-band HSDPA? We can only assume Verizon thought that with tri-band HSDPA, people would be unlocking these things left and right to use the devices on AT&T and Rogers. That would take out a decent chunk of their data revenue, but at the end of the day, are that many people who now can’t get a 3G Storm but rather a 2G one going to port to Verizon because of it? That remains to be seen, but all Storm first-hand impressions aside, this thing not having Wi-Fi at the very minimum is a major pain in the ass. Does anyone remember the “leaked” Expansys photo that had the Wi-Fi indicator in it? Funny, right? And to the commenters who will start saying, “It’s the best data network, you don’t need Wi-Fi!” You’re dumb, ignorant, and stupid. Plain and simple.
@ bluehorseshoe:
You never give up being an ass. With all your stupid nonsense spinning from all directions you should be in politics.
Let me educate you Verizon Wireless is NOT and NEVER has been a UNION Shop! They are NOT and NEVER have had their HQ in Manhattan. It is in Basking Ridge, NJ.
Verizon Corportation owns Verizon Telco, Verizon Wireless and Verizon Business. The only “UNION” is with the Telco! The OTHER two are not and never have been union.
Verizon Corporation owns the controlling half of Verizon Wireless with its partner Vodafone.
IF the union that exists ONLY at Verizon Telco is working for a contract and threatens to TRY to unionize Wireless or goes after Wireless to piss off Verizon Corp. what does have to do with the fact that Verizon Wireless being a non-union shop? Nothing.
Sorry as with some of your other non-sense you are wrong and no amount of spin will make you right! Verizon Wireless is a non-union company.
Why don’t you ask your buddies at the Verizon Wireless company owned store if they belong to a union? Maybe read something other than the garbage you sent.
@ Se:
I have both a Verizon and an AT&T phone and see little difference when it comes to dropped calls or data and I have traveled with them. In fact the AT&T data network in my home area is faster and AT&T is cheaper even offering roll-over minutes.
Some of the people of here drink the Verizon kool-aide and like to attack anyone who claims to be a happy AT&T customer as they claim there are none! What is the saying? 73 million can’t be ALL wrong.
The reason I as attacked so much is I had the gall to mention that I switched due to the lack of innovative mobile devices and the lack or WiFi on Verizon offered phones. Also that Verizon has neutered cameraphones in the past so you could not get your OWN photos off the device via Bluetooth or USB and had to PAY for this pleasure on the phone you already paid for. We owned two of these in my household.
See many of the phones Verizon offers belong in the toilet!
@ likeabite:
I guess what you are telling me, confirmed by Mike, is that RIM is not as good as designing and building mobile phones as Apple even on GSM.
iPhone Cellular and wireless
UMTS/HSDPA (850, 1900, 2100 MHz)
GSM/EDGE (850, 900, 1800, 1900 MHz)
Wi-Fi (802.11b/g)
Bluetooth 2.0 + EDR
Tri-band and WiFi look at that in a light thin package. Seems they had little problem “fitting” in the WiFi. Actually thinner than the Storm I think. This is amazing since they built their first one only 15 months ago.
Apple even offered it to Verizon on CDMA which they promptly refused. See the iPhone offered a different music store, ringtones, visual voicemail included, and its own maps for directions as well as WiFi. None of this is supported by VZW on any of their phones.
Before you get ready to complain about the iPhone, take another look at the G1 Android phone:
“Built-in support for T-Mobile’s 3G (HSDPA) and EDGE network as well as Wi-Fi; T-Mobile G1 will seamlessly transfer between 3G and accessible Wi-Fi networks including T-Mobile HotSpot locations worldwide”
Seems they fit in the WiFi radio also and yes it is a little bulky, but still a nice phone.
So I guess Mike was just telling us that RIM has no ability to build a device with WiFi even on GSM? You tell me, I am at a loss here.
As I have said each time. Whatever the reason is, was and continues to be it is a disadvantage to lock down customers. remove features (if that is what they have done), and not include WiFi when you can see some companies already have.
So either Vodafone – Verizon ordered the Storm without WiFi or RIM not able to build one, I will let you choice!
iPhone:
While I are at it, let’s clear something up about the iPhone. It does NOT completely lack background processes like people on here like to point out.
All the apps included on the iPhone WILL run in the background. ONLY third party apps have this limitation. The included app even run at the same time as the Third Party apps.
As I know the cut-paste argument is a big one. Several of the third party text apps in the App Store actually have cut-copy-paste. There just yet is no global one from Apple yet.
Coming soon will be better navigation (FREE, not at $10 a month) and messaging to allow for not having to run a Task Manager.
Cut-copy-paste globally will arrive in a simple software update that will be FREE.
There are over 6,000 apps available (many free) in the App Store. iPhone users lack little in functionality, really.
So much so RIM is trying their best to copy the iPhone (seems to have failed a bit with the Storm) and the App Store while they watch their stock sink and lower unit sales lost to iPhone.
If iPhone or Android was on Verizon, I think RIM would suffer the most!
Umm Paul I understand what you are saying and I never said it was not a feature people wanted. I agreed with BG on the fact that even if people do not need it or want it, it was still a good feature to have on any phone just for the simple fact that people like options. The purpose of this post however, was not about Verizon or them crippling their phones but that BG said it was Verizon’s fault that the wireless in this particular phone…the STORM was crippled and that is simply not true. Yes Verizon cripples phones but this one they had nothing 2 do with because all of the versions released including the GSM version does not have the feature and the CEO of the company that made it said there was no more room for it. That is the simple point of this post and that is what I’ve been saying the whole time.
And your point about the iPhone being a better smartphone than any blackberry is completely nonsensical. The iPhone is not even a smartphone to me. You can’t slap 3G on a phone and charge for data, allow apps to run on it and call it a smartphone. Essentially if you look at it that’s exactly what Apple did…that’s the ONLY difference between the first iPhone and the current one and that is the only reason why they’ve dubbed it a smartphone. What a smartphone is supposed to do the iPhone has not even began to realize yet. Yes it has a fantastic UI, it’s extremely user-friendly, it has thousands of apps and a great browser. All of that has nothing to do with being a smartphone. Smartphones deal with feature sets and what a phone is capable of. You may have heard all of these arguments before but that is what makes a phone a smart phone. Period. If a phone can’t do these basic things that differentiates it from common dumbphones then it is just not a smartphone. Smartphones have to be able to run background processes. You can’t have a smartphone without being able to run more than one program at once. It is completely asinine to think you can especially when there are thousands of programs to choose from and you can only run one at once. That is what dumbphones do buddy. It defeats the entire purpose of the apps store if you cannot run more than one of those programs that you downloaded. If you’re sensible you will agree with me on this and not try to argue such a simple point. Cut and paste is a key feature that differentiates smartphones from other phones. Yes it has been said over and over again but the ability to manipulate text is what is essential to smartphones…their purpose is for the high end consumers and business elites and if you can’t copy and paste text then you cannot edit office documents the way they are meant to be. Even viewing office documents on a smartphone is essential and I dont even know if the iPhone supports that but I doubt it. If they do then that’s one in their column. The iPhone if you really look at the feature set and what it is capable of is a web 2.0 phone just like the LG Voyager. Now you can say those are simple things and they are being worked on but until a phone is capable of doing these things then don’t bother calling it a smartphone. there are many others I can tag on to this list but I’ll leave it at that. The Google Android phone I would say is more of a smartphone than the iPhone. Yes I’ve used both and know what each is capable of if you want to know. If Apple had actually thought of making an actual smartphone then I would understand but if you even look at the commercials they have for the iPhone 3G all it says is that it is faster. Faster does not make a nonsmartphone a smartphone…all they did was upgrade it to 3G and tag on the App Store. Unless they did something drastically different that I’m missing or do you think the original iPhone was a smartphone also. Windows Mobile is a smartphone platform (thousands more apps than the iPhone app store and with a central app store on its way with the release of WinMo7) Symbian is a smartphone platform (thousands of apps more than the Iphone App Store as well). Blackberry is a smartphone platform (PS their own app store is on the way so that whole apps argument is out the window). The iPhone and Android are on their way but still not there yet buddy. And I know you are going to say Apple gave them the App Store idea but that still has nothing to do with the fact that the iPhone is really not a smartphone if you think about it. 3G does not make you a smartphone.
@ Paul…the iPhone does not run background processes. The only way a phone runs background processes is if it has a way of notifying you of what is going on with that background process. The iphone does not do that. Period. You literally have to close out of a program to open a new one. Whatever program you use takes up the entire screen and you have to home key it to go and start a new program. And fyi the Storm has a lot more radios in it than the iPhone. I won’t go and retrieve the BGR post that lists them all because it is pointless but that argument you just made makes no sense. It has the most radios out of any phone on the market now. The fact that third party companies have to make cut and paste accessible to iphone users is not only pathetic but shows why the iphone cannot even be mentioned in the same breath as Blackberries or Windows Mobile phones. That is like buying a phone with a camera but you cannot send the pictures you take to your friends and then a third party app has to help you accomplish that…oh no wait,that’s the iphone also. And lets not forget the fact that you cannot even record video. What smartphone cannot do any of this…even the G1 makes you send pictures even though you cannot record video. It’s absurd.
@ likeabite:
OK we are in agreement on the points that WiFi is an important and desired feature. Also that Verizon does cripple phones. Now, THIS IS progress.
I however NEVER pointed out that the iPhone was a better phone than a BB. I was showing you that Apple and HTC on the Android G1 had no problem “fitting” a wifi radio in a GSM device! I did say I liked the iPhone better.
RIM claiming not to be able to do the same is either because they have no ability to build phones with WiFi or it was ordered this way (no matter what Mike says). Again I will let you choice which.
As with most users I do not really care why. It just does not have an important feature. Apple did it in a thin device with only 15 months experience in making phones. AND you have to admit WiFi does not seem to be a feature that Verizon Wireless has much use for!
As far as if the iPhone is a smartphone or not and all the semantics around this, who cares. It runs OS X and is a very capable device.
Pointing out the Android phone and saying that this is a smartphone and the iPhone is not is a bit silly as it runs Linux a variant of UNIX which is the same as OS X in many many ways. They even share some of the same Google apps.
The iPhone “third party apps” have to be run one at a time. The build in apps do not! Mail, iPod, browser, contacts, SMS, Maps, Weather, Notes, YouTube, Calculator all can be run without shutting down one in other.
I know you love your BB and maybe even Windows Mobile and that is fine. I am not here to convert anyone as I use them all. I think however you might try living with an iPhone a bit before you pass judgment. Maybe ONLY then you might realize why many people have chosen them over BB and others and EVEN switched carriers to do it.
I have owned Nokias, Windows Mobile, Palms, and BB and the iPhone in many cases at the same time as I work in the industry. I actually have three cell phones right now). The iPhone is the best device I have used and the most productive (FOR ME) and I am a heavy user.
If I am listening to music while checking my mail and getting notices when mail or SMS arrives…
When I am browsing and getting SMS and mail notices as well as using my contacts and maps. THIS is “notifying my of what is going on with that background process.”
Only third party apps no not have this ability. They will soon, as Apple is bringing messaging using the cloud instead of a Task Manager in a future software update. Could be a trend as it is quite innovative. Different from some other devices NOT necessary inferior.
Spec sheets and lists of info is all cool, but actual USE is how you should evaluate a device.
You claim the “iphone cannot even be mentioned in the same breath as Blackberries or Windows Mobile phones.” Great this sounds so cool, except the iPhone out sold both in 3Q to the same customers that probably might have bought BB and Windows Mobile. Your statement did not impress them I guess.
The LG Voyager and the Sprint Instinct are garbage compared to an iPhone or Android or BB. Bad comparison and shows me you probably never actually used the iPhone. I have evaluated all of these as I work in the industry,
SURE glad SOMEONE FINALLY agreed that Verizon sold cameraphones with neutered Bluetooth and USB so you HAD to PAY to get your photos off. It is denied on here all the time and I still have a drawer with two of these in it!
By the way the G1 does not record video. I know you read that on BGR I saw your comments on the story. So does this make it NOT a smartphone? Both the iPhone and Android will probably get this feature.
See the term “smartphone” is semantics. You can pick and choose what is and what isn’t. Most users could actually care less. I don’t. You can come up a list of features and if a phone does not have any single one of them you can say. OH, that is not a smartphone!
How about WiFi? Is lack of WiFi a reason something is NOT a smartphone?
YOU SAY “The iPhone is not even a smartphone to me. ”
Well guess what, if the device does not have WiFi and I am sitting in a FREE hotspot with no 3G (this actually happens more than you might like to admit) you no not have a “smartphone” you have a “BRICK”
IN MY OPINION no WiFi makes it not a “smartphone.” Having ONLY the ability for 3G and NOT the much faster WiFi makes it what? A “smartphone” that is slower than what? HAHa
So in this case the iPhone is a “smarter-phone” Actually the iPhone and Android are both a lot closer to a mobile computers than any BB.
BB is a competent phone and a decent business tool, but certainly not the “end-all” device. Remember I have a Curve. It pales in comparison to the iPhone. Again in my opinion and probably in the opinion of the buyers of the 12 million sold in 2008!
The iPhone is certainly NOT perfect. NONE of these devices are. Many of the iPhone’s missing features will be added in simple free software updates as many have already. EVEN you have to admit that Apple has done quite a bit in 15 short months. They literally changed the industry like it or not.
The iPhone apps store has ONLY been open since July 2008 (that is only 4 months) and already has 6,000 apps. This is why RIM and others are trying so hard to copy Apple’s model. I will say this again 6,000 apps in one place in ONLY a few months! MS and BB have been around for many years and NEVER even thought of an App Store until Apple did it an 200 million apps were downloaded.
I have already downloaded several apps that are also the same ones I tried on Palm, BB and Windows Mobile as they were ported over or re-written for iPhone. Guess what? Most all of them are better on iPhone and many have additional features. NOT bad for not being what YOU call a “smartphone.”
The iPhone can read Office files. You can edit documents also. I do this with cut-copy-and paste with my iPhone all the time. In fact there are several apps that are free to do this in the App Store with the more advanced ones cost all of about $5 or $6.
DataViz Documents to Go and Quick Office are coming to the iPhone soon as announced by their makers. Who could blame them Apple has millions of users. These are the very same apps used on Palm, BB, Windows Mobile and Symbian. Check their websites. BB has no big advantage here anymore sorry.
I actually have not missed global cut-copy-paste that much as I can easily sent contact info iPhone to iPhone over any network or email (Handshake or Send Contact or iBeam which are all FREE apps). Again this shows you NEVER used an iPhone.
Now since you are hell bent on comparing. Do you think that the BB can come even close on the iPhone’s multi-touch UI, browser, Music & Video Playback (it is an iPod) and ebook reader features. NOT on your life.
Wait I will save you the trouble. “BB is a serious business tool.” Yes and so is the iPhone it supports Exchange out of the box! There is also support for Lotus Notes, I have used both on the iPhone.
Seems most of your assessments have been made only reading blogs that want to push BB and you have never used the iPhone. Just go over and read Crackberry blogs and you would think the BB cured world hunger (same for pro iPhone blogs). That is no alternative to actually using the device for everyday use and business for evaluating a devices capabilities.
I think I kindly, pointed out some facts above you may not been aware of. Again I am not trying to convert anyone, but it is a bit annoying reading the divisive stuff and mis-information written all over this blog in the comments. Then these same people wonder why people buy other devices saying “hell they must be stupid.”
Take this ass BlueHorseSlipper who is still claiming that VZW is a union shop and there HQ on 6th Ave in Manhattan! The ass says it over and over again as if its fact and he thinks if he spins it enough times he will somehow be correct! VZW HQ is in Basking Ridge and they are NOT Union, but he says different, HaHaHa
@ likeabite:
From Wikipedia:
“A smartphone is a mobile phone offering advanced capabilities beyond a typical mobile phone, often with PC-like functionality. There is no industry standard definition of a smartphone. For some, a smartphone is a phone that runs complete operating system software providing a standardized interface and platform for application developers. For others, a smartphone is simply a phone with advanced features like e-mail and Internet capabilities, and/or a full keyboard.
There is no agreement in the industry about what a smartphone actually is and definitions have changed over time. According to David Wood, EVP at Symbian, “Smart phones differ from ordinary mobile phones in two fundamental ways: how they are built and what they can do.” Other definitions put different stresses on these two factors.”
By the way the iPhone is LISTED as a smartphone on wikipedia along with many others.
@ Paul…I’ll keep this short since I have the elections to focus on. I know all those third party apps you mentioned and that is exactly my point. If a phone has to rely on third party apps to perform such basic functions then there clearly something wrong. Second, the Blackberries without Wifi would not be smartphones either, correct? I’ve never owned a blackberry so it’s not like I’m here trying to proclaim it as the greatest device ever. I think Symbian and Windows Mobile are more capable devices than Blackberries and the iPhone because you can have more control over what you can do to them and hacking and what not. And to quote Wikipedia for the definition of a smartphone then that would leave room for many other phones because the Voyager and Instinct would all be smartphones.
@ likeabite:
Fine, the iPhone does NOT depend on any third party apps anymore than any one of these other devices. Again you simply never touched the device and obviously do not know.
Example, none of the so-called smartphones edit Office documents natively. All of them need to have an app for this installed. It may even come pre-installed , but it is NOT native. Same for VNC and some other apps.
The word “smartphone” as I already said means absolutely NOTHING! So as I already said WHO cares.
Only using the device is what matters.
The BB has little over the iPhone and soon will have nothing over it at all. This is why I always laugh when I hear the crackberry guys acting like it is so advanced when it the OS looks like the 1990 and is basically a step above a Palm that I carried in the early 90s.
@ Paul again you refuse to read before responding. I use the iPhone on a daily basis so how have I never touched one? And I agree with you that the Blackberry is outdated in a lot of ways…but even in that state it is still a few steps above the iphone. And your argument about office editing documents…Windows Mobile does not need third party apps for that…it is native to the OS. And editing office documents is completely different from cut and paste or recording video. It’s like comparing apples and oranges sir.
I wanted this post to reach 300 just for the sake of BGR so they can have their first ever 300 posting (hopefully there hasn’t been one already) but I’ll end here. Obama won and that alone is enough to stop this argument lol.
@ likeabite:
Gee, really Windows Mobile made by Microsoft can edit Office files made by Microsoft! Wow. Now this is ridiculous! Really! So can most any advanced mobile device or Windows, Mac or Linux machine with a pretty easy to install software (some even FREE). We were talking BB here and the iPhone works the same way for editing Office files with the very same software coming.
For someone that NOW says he uses and iPhone you seem to have little idea how it works. As you say here:
“Even viewing office documents on a smartphone is essential and I dont even know if the iPhone supports that but I doubt it. If they do then that’s one in their column.
The iPhone if you really look at the feature set and what it is capable of is a web 2.0 phone just like the LG Voyager.”
If you ever touched an iPhone I would be surprised, you certainly have no idea of its capabilities – IN YOUR OWN WORDS! At no time did you say you owned an iPhone and defended VZW and BB to the hilt. Spin? Maybe!
No arguments the comments are here for all to read and make up their own mind and use their own wallet.
I could care less how won an election as it has little to do with the post or comments here.
Might want to take a look at another vote that happen yesterday at the FCC approving Sprint – Clearwire and White Space stuff. Shows WiFi and WiMax surely is not dead and will change the wireless industry in the not too distant future.
Sorry just had to tell you that you just proved my point. The iPhone is a web 2.0 phone…not a smartphone…unless you want to count the LG Voyager as a smartphone in the same light as WinMo and Symbian.
And I never said I owned an iphone…there’s at least 2 in my house that i use on the regular so what’s your point?
And if the software is coming that still proves my point that the iPhone is still not there yet…It is coming in terms of being a smartphone as well.
And as for the white spectrum and wifi I already agreed that it is a great feature to have buddy.
Are you kidding me? You two are still arguing? I’ve been reading this for days now… and wow. lol
I am however surprised that Paul didn’t respond to my comment a couple days ago. Does that mean I was right?
@ likeabite:
WOW, you are just too tricky for me. How can I compete with a spinmeister like you. You are so scary smart and quick on your feet. YOU spin faster than my washing machine!
EXCEPT you said, “Even viewing office documents on a smartphone is essential and I dont even know if the iPhone supports that but I doubt it. If they do then that’s one in their column.”
Does not sound like a guy that has much knowledge of an iPhone!
First you spun the smartphone moniker, now its a Web 2.0 moniker. Neither have any true meaning! Spin Spin spin some more!
I am dizzy from all your bull. It spins so much most of the other readers are probably dizzy also!
You are a guy that wants it both ways and will say just about anything to prove some cryptic point that few people care about.
Does not matter. You finally admitted after spinning for days, that the BB was not all that, WiFi matters, and that VZW cripples and neuters many of their phones. On all this WE actually agree.
I showed you the iPhone and the Android phone had no problem fitting in a WiFi radio and have no good reason that “Mike” at RIM could not! No matter leaves VZW BB users with NO WiFi and AT&T BB users WITH WiFi and 18,000 hotspots to use in the US FREE of charge!
The only thing the Storm has killed was itself for leaving out features many people want and coping the iPhone best it can. HaHaHa
As far as the iPhone goes I said in almost every comment I was NOT here to covert you. I really did not care what you liked. But you better find a way to show all the other 12 million iPhone buyers in 2008 alone how something else is better! As just today alone Apple market value is OVER THREE TIMES RIMM and higher even than Verizon. Check it out.
I guess all those buys do not care which moniker you are spinning! HaHaHa
Your retarded brother BlueHorseShit ran away when he had NO answer to him being wrong on VZW being a union company and NEVER having a HQ in Manhattan.
Hey, BlueHorseShit – VZW is a NON Union Company that has their HQ in Basking Ridge, NJ. If you going to idolize a company you might as well have some facts. HaHaHa
Thanks for the entertainment I sure did not learn anything except some good “spin” methods!
@ JustMe we’re all right when it comes to Paul…and I’m only entertaining this to get BGR to 300 comments.
@ Paul I’m amazed by your knack for writing and completely flabbergasted by your inability to read. My first initial post I acknowledged that Wifi was important if you care to let someone read that for you. I also never said Blackberries were the greatest devices but that in their present state is far ahead of the iphone. Then I proceeded to say that Verizon crippling phones had nothing to do with this post because it was not their fault as to why there was no Wifi…which is what this post is about so where did I spin.
I said the iphone was not a smartphone to me by my standards and you said well different people had different standards. Then you proceeded to say “The iPhone if you really look at the feature set and what it is capable of is a web 2.0 phone just like the LG Voyager.” That is EXACTLY what I had said previously that the iphone was not a smartphone but similar to the Voyager and the Dare, which you decided to argue with me about. So if I say it is not a smartphone and say it is more like a web 2.0 phone then how is that spinning? If I had called it a smartphone before then you would have an argument sir. Web 2.0 phones are not smartphones. If anyone cares to chime in the LG Voyager is not a smartphone. Or else there would be no need for the name deviations because they have different standards and what they can do. So if you are calling the iphone a web 2.0 phone then it is not a smartphone like I previously stated, correct?
These are all the radios inside the Storm:
UMTS/HSPA: 2100 MHz
North America: 850 MHz GSM®/GPRS networks
North America: 1900MHz GSM/GPRS networks
Europe/Asia Pacific: 1800MHz GSM/GPRS networks
Europe/Asia Pacific: 900MHz GSM/GPRS networks
Dual-Band: 800/1900 MHz CDMA/Ev-DO networks
Stereo Bluetooth 2.0 + ERD
These are all the radios inside the iphone 3G:
UMTS/HSDPA (850, 1900, 2100 MHz)
GSM/EDGE (850, 900, 1800, 1900 MHz)
Wi-Fi (802.11b/g)
Bluetooth 2.0 + EDR
These are all the radios inside the Android G1:
HSPA/WCDMA:
Europe: 2100 MHz
US:1700/2100 MHz
Up to 7.2 Mbps down-link (HSDPA) and 2 Mbps up-link (HSUPA) speeds
Quad-band GSM/GPRS/EDGE:
850/900/1800/1900 MHz
Bluetooth® 2.0 with Enhanced Data Rate
Wi-Fi®: IEEE 802.11b/g
Now do you see that the Storm has more radios than both of these devices with its inclusion of the CMDA radios and and thus there is some rationale in that there might not have been enough speech on the board for it? Neither the G1 or iphone have support for those frequencies, thus leaving room for Wifi so if you still don’t see this then I guess you’re a lost cause.
@ likeabite:
Who cares if YOU think the iPhone is not a smartphone? I don’t care what YOU call it and neither did the 12 million this year that bought it! Your “monikers’ have no bearing on anyone! I even showed you wikipedia even said that the term “smartphone” means NOTHING. Neither does Web 2.0 (it actually means little to the web).
By comparing the iPhone to a piece of garbage like the neutered and useless toy which is the LG Voyager it is CLEAR you never used an iPhone, no matter what you claim NOW.
You had NO idea if an iPhone could even edit or view documents! You claimed NO apps can run at the same time, thats WRONG. So are you a liar or stupid? Tell me can you edit documents on a LG Voyager? Use Exchange Server? Use Lotus Notes? Load a VNC, RDP, SSH, WebDAV, FTP, edit a website, app on the LG Voyager? Do you even know what these are? Tell us please….
From your description of the iPhone all you did was read a spec sheet or see an ad. You are, in your own words, clueless to the capabilities of the device.
I do not need your info on these phones I has most of them here in my shop! My experience is from USING them, not reading ads.
The iPhone with WiFi is a more capable device than YOUR precious neutered VZW BB WIHOUT WiFi no matter what moniker you are using today.
Try using your VZW BB in a FREE hotspot when your 3G sucks or does not exist. Or inside many buildings when 3G is weak and WiFi is sitting right there.
Try using your WiFi-less BB to get work done fast, as the fastest 3G comes nowhere close to a WiFi connection for speed or when VZW decides to block ports leaving you with device that can not do the task you need to do.
Do you realize that VZW so called unlimited data plan is NOT unlimited? They were sued for this and had to change the fine print. Go read what “unlimited”means. No WiFi just may be a pattern other than “fit” maybe since it seems to be missing across the entire lineup of phones they offer. Its just a thought.
I would rather travel with ANY WiFi enabled phone, iPhone or another then what you want to call “smartphone” that is a BRICK, and not so smart, without 3G services or when there is no CDMA in another country.
I especially will smile wide the VERY next time I fire up Skype or TruPhone VoIP on my iPhone at the next FREE hotspot when traveling like I often do. When I think YOUR mighty “not-so-smartphone” with all its invisible whizzbang features you claim will be either a BRICK or cost you an arm an a leg to simply call home, never mind use the Internet!
Call the iPhone whatever you want, I – and the other 12 million plus users that outsold RIM and MS this year do not care. HaHa
So none of the other BBs and most ALL of the Windows Mobile that VZW offers can “fit” WiFi either right? Its a “fit” problem in all of these cases? Sure it is now. Just like it was a “fit” problem for the neutered cameraphones Bluetooth and USB transfer feature of photos on Verizon.
BUT for $10 a month they will ALLOW you to transfer YOUR own pictures on the neutered cameraphones they sold you. They will also LET you use navigation for another $10 a month, or buy a song over the air for $1.99 (double the price of ALL others) from ONLY their music store. All while having the highest rates of any carrier in the US. BUT NO WiFi FOR You! What a bargain!
Come spin for us some more we enjoy watching you dance. I will remind you the YOU already have admitted in several comments that VZW cripples and neuters their phones and WiFi is important. Right? I read that somewhere I think.
I am so dumb, I know that asses on here claim that they KNOW all Verizon and say that VZW has a HQ on 6th avenue and is a union shop! Then they hide! Are they neutral too? Are they right? HaHaHa
Is 300 your big number? No problem. If you have the time to waste, and since it seems you do, why not.
I can repeat the facts as many times as it takes for you to absorb them. I have taught children that were challenged before.
Damn Paul it seems you’re losing your cool. First no insults and that’s what you’re referring to by calling me stupid. How the mighty have fallen…reminds me of McCain. Now you want to make Voyager and iphone comparisons. I never compared them buddy…just said they’re in the same phone category…same thing you said by saying thay they are both web 2.0 phones. If that term meant nothing then why bring it up and why go through the trouble of quoting wikipedia as your academic source for smartphones if it means nothing lol. Don’t be bitter Paul, doesn’t suit you well.I liked the arguments better when you were cool, calm and clueless.
And me stating that I dont know if the iphone could edit documents is simply because I never tried to use the pointless thing for such a task…mostly because I doubt it could accomplish it well without cut and paste. All the things you mentioned that the iphone can do are all because of third party apps buddy. That has nothing to do with the core product itself. If you buy a car and get navigation systems and tvs to put in the car that does not mean that the car is naturally capable of taking you everywhere you want to go or watching tv. You want to bitch and moan about the ten dollars a month for transferring stuff on Verizon…please tell me how much each of those programs you listed cost. Maybe you’ve lost your ability to make a feasible argument so I’ll let uou slide on that pointless rant you just went on.
@ Paul and likeabite
You guys are hilarious…
You guys do know that there are several reasons for choosing a particular device – right?
So this argument can go on forever because from the way I read it – both of you make some interesting points.
Paul, I think you are being played lol – you need to relax
@likeabite
LOL – At this rate I’m almost certain you guys will make it to 300. It may be a week from now, but I can def see it happening.
@Paul
Just an FYI, we (my verizon store) have the machines that transfer numbers, pictures, and so on from one device to the other and we charge $0 for that service. That and if you haven’t realized it yet AT&T’s navigation is also 10 per month.
@ Jay:
I know they are trying to play me believe me. This all started when several of them tried their best to rip into a few of us that simply agreed with the post that Verizon probably neutered the BB Storm since it is clear they have a long history of neutering their phones and not supporting WiFi.
Thanks for jumping in but I am not upset really. It is all entertaining to me watching them spin. Also pretty clear to the other readers they thought they may be influencing.
To be fair likeabite isn’t a bad guy and actually stepped back after another reader basically called him a douchbag for the personal attacks in his earlier comments. It is clear however that spinning is all they have with little in the way of facts.
One ass, BlueHorseShit or something, disappeared after losing his argument where he claimed that VZW HQ was on 6th Avenue in Manhattan and was a Union shop. For the record their HQ is in Basking Ridge, NJ and VZW are NOT union and never was headquartered in NYC.
Of course people choose different devices for different reasons, that is EXACTLY the point I have made over and over when it came to the iPhone, Android and WiFi enabled phones that Verizon WILL NOT offer. I have a BB Curve on VZW as well as an iPhone. I actually have for cell phones right now (also a Nokia and a Windows Mobile). I work in the industry.
They just got all bent out of shape when I told them AT&T gained one million customers on the iPhone that were taken away from VZW. Many people have switched carriers due to NO WiFi support, me being one of them.
They say ONLY VZW is a decent carrier. Funny they can’t seem to explain the 12 million iPhones sold in 2008, Apple beating both RIM and MS in sales in 3Q, or the 73 million AT&T customers.
They even try and claim they have owned certain devices while having no idea how they worked. It is hilarious, far more entertaining the watching the pros, the politicians spin!
@ JustMe:
WOW, that is great news for the people who got screwed on those purposely crippled cameraphones that all those people bought from Verizon. Now they can drive all the way down to the nearest Verizon Store, if there is one near them, and wait in the busy store to transfer their OWN pictures. Great even with $4 gas prices!
What a great deal, especially after paying for the phone! Only an ass the loves a company that screws him for some sick reason would say this is good!
WoW, so convenient. Maybe it would have better to use a FILM camera and take the film down to get processed! This is fantastic news!
Actually, they have NOT also offered this at all (ask some in my own household that got stuck with the cripples phones. Plus they actually charge $10 to transfer contacts at the Verizon Store! The iPhone and many others you can do it yourself for free as it sync out of the box with your computer.
At least you are admitting that the cameraphones they screwed people with exist. Plenty on this website deny it. I can sell two of them to anyone who want to buy them cheap as they have iPhones now.
The navigation I was speaking of is part of the iPhone and Android. The very devices VZW will not offer. They have built-in navigation that is quite good and will only get better at NO charge.
Verizon does not like to offer anything on a phone to compete with what they sell leaving you dopey customers no choices. Why are you dopey? Because you guys defend, NO CHOICES and the company that does this.
Verizon does not like to offer devices that have WiFi, Navigation, or use a music store they control and charge double the going rate for songs and ringtones!
Crippling the cameraphones to try and rip money from their customers that paid for the phone to retrieve their OWN photos is only one example you see.
Other carriers do not seem to care they offer services, but also offers choice.
Disagree if you like so I can laugh some more, but even likeabite agreed with me on this, read his posts!
@ likeabite:
The personal insults were thrown my way and it wasn’t until another reader pointed that out that made you back off and get civil. Simple proof is in the comments.
So I get it now, this new spin that somehow makes you an expert of some sort. HAHA
As you spin here:
“And me stating that I dont know if the iphone could edit documents is simply because I never tried to use the pointless thing for such a task…mostly because I doubt it could accomplish it well without cut and paste. ”
So you used the iPhone before you didn’t use the iPhone and KNOW all the advanced features by NOT tying any of them and having no idea what is possible or what’s available? Sure that is as clear as mud and show all the readers that you have a really good handle of what the device could do. In my job I would get fired for a spin like that! HAHA Did the dog eat your homework this week also?
The same app that edits the documents HAS Cut Copy Paste and is the SAME Apps that exists on BB and Palm and Nokia – Maybe reading is your problem as I already told you this a few times. BUT in your fast SPIN to try and prove some wacky point I guess you missed it. Since even you admit you never tried it and have no idea it exists! Maybe this is why you have no idea of much other than the BB you play with.
You need an app on Nokia, Palm, and BB to edit documents. This is stupid argument really and spin all you want it is easy to do, I do it all the time and some of the apps are free! BUT I will give you credit to announce that Microsoft includes the feature on their OWN phones for their OWN apps! Wow!
I think you must have used a computer before, my guess Windows only. But even you must realize you need an app to edit and view documents on a computer, yet it hasn’t stopped computers from advancing or being popular with actual people. OpenOffice is even free.
Maybe you have memory loss, but lucky for us we can just look at your prior comments just above where YOU compared the iPhone and the Voyager! Again you are spinning.
Same category, hardly. The iPhone runs OS X, has an SDK, thousand of developers, 6,000 plus apps, 200 million downloads, Microsoft Exchange support, Lotus Notes support, multi-touch, WiFi, and is an iPod, just to name a few. Spin some more. Boy we are getting dizzy there, junior.
Spinning does not win you arguments it just makes you look stupid. Sure I know you really want to get to 300, but do you still want to spin and look stupid getting there. All you have done for me and many many BGR readers is make them re-think the nonsense that sometimes read from the kool-aide drinkers like you and your retarded brother BlueHorseSlipperShit.
I love when you come off like an authority and then it is quickly realized you never even tried the feature and have NO idea what you are talking about.
@ likeabite…Just ignore him, no matter what he says. I think we all know what we’re dealing with here.
@bluehorseshoe:
Sure it doesn’t matter what I say, I just exposed your lack of knowledge for all to see. I did not want to bother with you, but it was YOUR big mouth that started with the personal attacks and stupid statements.
How dare I point out VZW did not support WiFi and crippled many of their phones. Nobody should buy anything from a different carrier that was not a BB, according to you.
It was you who said on Nov 2, 2008 @ 6:15 pm, “Wanna debate with me? Bring it on!” So I did.
And on Nov 2, 2008 @ 11:57 pm you claimed that VZW was a union shop. You insisted for days that VZW had a HQ on 6th Avenue in Manhattan and was Union. Both wrong. But why bother with little things like facts when YOU wanted to tell what you thought was a good story?
I told you their HQ was not in Manhattan and never was. VZW HQ has always been in NJ. It is in Basking Ridge and VZW has NEVER been a Union shop.
After exposing your lack of knowledge when you tried to come off as some type of expert, you STILL can not admit you were wrong. Instead you ran around the Internet trying to find any scrap of stuff that somehow supported your nonsense and came up short.
So if you can not admit to something as basic as where YOUR favorite company HQ is located and they are NOT Union, why would anyone think you had any idea of what you are talking about?
So tell us all, where is VZW HQ and are they a Union shop?
What you dealing with is YOUR worse nightmare a reader that KNOWS you are full of shit! What’s more ALL can see this. Thanks for the fun.
OK 270….30 more to go
@ Paul – You just said I compared the iphone to the Voyager…umm I just copied and posted what you stated to you and still you don’t know your own comments. You clearly stated that the iphone is a web 2.0 phone like the voyager and now I’m the only one comparing. I think your asinine nature makes you even repudiate your own comments. No app on the iphone gives you the ability of copy and paste…whether it is a third party app or a work around. The only work around that it has was what BGR posted a while back and even he stated that it wasn’t that good because it still had many limitations. Whatever office editing third party apps you use is besides the point as this blackberry storm that we are talking about in this post comes with an app to edit documents…you have to pay for it on the iphone…just like every other app. And even the workaround to copy and paste…which does not work, mind you, you have to pay for. AT&T prices are identical to Verizon’s…you have to also pay to have your numbers transferred at both companies…just depends on where you end up going that it might be free so all this dumb talk needs to stop.
Obviously you’re an iPhone expert and you’ve used every single feature it has to offer right…otherwise my argument that I don’t know if it can edit documents is correct because I’ve had a Windows Mobile phone for 4 years and still don’t know half of the things it can do. It’s only logical because it has thousands of apps and capabilities. Unless I go on a quest to become a WinMo master or some shit, which is what you seem to be proclaiming with the iphone. Good luck on that journey and let me know how that works out for ya. Oh yea, sorry you can’t try Opera mini on that journey since Apple won’t let it on their phone because it’s better than Safari. Funny how Windows Mobile with IE allows any browser and even Symbian but Apple won’t let shit on their phone the deem competitive. And you want to talk about neutering phones. The only thing you can do with the iphone is what it natively comes with and the apps they provide you. Everyone agrees that after you connect it to the computer aside from itunes thats about all you can do to the phone. Windows Mobile and Symbian allows for countless manipulations, hacks and tweaks to the phone that i bought to fit my needs. So even if Verizon neutered the Windows Mobile phone I have the ability to hack and treat it as a personal computer makes its capabilities 10 times that of the iphone sir.
We went back and forth for a while and as soon as people began to chime in they all agreed with me…doesn’t that mean you’re the only one going off-track in this post? Quick, find someone to come and chime in on this that will say you’re right and we’ll all believe you. Hurry.
@ likeabite:
OH, please stop as my mouth is getting filled with garbage provided by a dancing guy who is getting more desperate by the moment to spin away from what he already wrote. Lucky for all of us YOUR comments are all here to read and check.
I did NOT mention or compare the Voyager phone, YOU did, when you compared them on Nov 4, 2008 @ 9:16 am right above. I invite all to take a look. You included!
What you said was “Even viewing office documents on a smartphone is essential and I dont even know if the iPhone supports that but I doubt it. If they do then that’s one in their column. The iPhone if you really look at the feature set and what it is capable of is a web 2.0 phone just like the LG Voyager.”
I would say that THIS is mentioning the Voyager and comparing it to the iPhone right out of YOUR mouth.
I then told you the LG Voyager was a piece of garbage and the word smartphone and web 2.0 has little real meaning. I NEVER compared the iPhone to this junk, YOU DID and the comments above prove it. Lying, forgetting, what?
Several apps in the App Store have cut-copy-paste I have downloaded three of them. NO work around just an inexpensive app available to anyone. So if you can not find them I guess maybe reading is a problem for you or as I suspect your NEVER touched an iPhone.
AT&T offers roll-over minutes, FREE hotspots, choice of music stores, use of WiFi and phones with FREE navigation as well as better options for international calling. This alone makes them cheaper. I switched and saved money as their data rates are also cheaper
You say here:
“Obviously you’re an iPhone expert and you’ve used every single feature it has to offer right…otherwise my argument that I don’t know if it can edit documents is correct because I’ve had a Windows Mobile phone for 4 years and still don’t know half of the things it can do.”
Well to answer you. Since I make my entire income in tech, work in this business and have been paid to evaluate products for many years, I apparently am more of an expert than you (in your own words). I have certifications in many areas in this industry and I still do not consider myself an expert. BUT I most certainly KNOW how to use what YOU SAID was so vital, viewing and editing documents.
I also know the apps exist to view edit and cut-copy-paste on the iPhone. I even named some of them for you. If they were so vital to you, why then do you have NO IDEA it can be done? Maybe because you never touched an iPhone.
Another myth I will debunk for you here. Opera mini was NEVER rejected from the App Store. In fact, it was never even submitted! Do not have to believe me, Opera said it never submitted it (Google it). Opera has less than a 1 percent market share of browsers and Opera mini is not very secure as it tunnels your info thru Opera’s servers and is not recommended for critical things like banking (Opera said this on their own web site, not me).
Opera mini is NOT better than Safari on an iPhone. I have used it on several devices including BB. EVEN your beloved BB Storm is using webkit the open source version that Safari is based on without the nicer features of the iPhone. So if “Mike” at RIM agreed with you, he might have included Opera mini instead! But he didn’t. He included webkit.
Windows Mobile and Symbian offers no browser anywhere as good Mobile Safari on the iPhone. Mobile Safari as it is the best in class right now (even you admitted this in a previous post).
OK, apps on the iPhone seem to be a stumbling block for you, a non-user. So I will teach you.
RIM is essentially using a Java platform on their proprietary BB OS. The apps run in a Java VM (virtual machine) which includes only a simple 2D gaming API. That means the BB can not yet support any of the rich 3D games you can get for the iPhone, and can only support typical cell phone games.
OH wait, the BB is a business tool, YOU do not care about games, right?
Well maybe, but the Storm is being put up against the iPhone and aimed and marketed to consumers, so this matters big time.
Apple decided early on to use Cocoa, Object-C and its OWN SDK that is free to download instead as it viewed running Java VM as a limitation for is “smarter phone”
The result of this is that the iPhone and the iPod touch have become one of the leading mobile gaming platforms in only 4 months.
RIM is now even planning its own BB app store to copy Apple’s, Right now there are only a small amount of apps now available for BB (none for the Storm yet). RIM, you know that company run by your friend “Mike” reported 650 last summer after years of third party development. This in comparison to the over 6,000 iPhone apps with 200 million downloads in just 4 months.
Most BB apps may be useful, but are usually weaker than iPhone equivalents, especially the games. They are also typically cost a bit more starting at $15 rather than being $2 to $8 like most in the App Store. RIM is now hurrying to get a better SDK for developers, but have a way to go to match the ease of developing for just ONE model type iPhone that already has 12 million – 15 million users (probably more if you count the iPod touch that the apps also run on).
While the Storm offers better camera, it does not deliver the UI polish, simplicity, and iTunes integration (that you just knocked in your last comment) that attracted so many users to the iPhone.
And as we all know now the Storm lacks WiFi which is an important aspect of mobile gaming for consumer customers the Storm is being aimed at. See WiFi is not just good for business and travelers as I pointed out several times it is needed for head-to-head gaming.
So is your smartphone really that smart? Does the term even matter? No to both!
Many of the iPhones limitations are due to it only being 15 months old. Even selling more units in 3Q than RIM and WM they do have to grow the platform more. Many features will be added free in future software updates. If you actually believe that Apple can not match some of the other devices moving forward I really think you are nuts. Whatever YOU like calling the iPhone, it runs a robust OS.
YES, keep telling yourself, ALL agree with me. HAHA Probably most people that have read your comments went away laughing. I am sure they laughed at mine as I bothered to respond to your nonsense with actual facts.
I guess you also believe VZW is a union shop with its HQ in Manhattan right? You are spinning your OWN words the same way that ass is. Notice his argument went away, but the insults stayed. I am sure they laughed at BlueHorsesAss as he was so wrong.
YOU say here:
“..even if Verizon neutered the Windows Mobile phone I have the ability to hack and treat it as a personal computer makes its capabilities 10 times that of the iphone…”
Can you hack back on WiFi? Please tell me so all the readers on here that they have a solution to the neutered device they have from VZW.
Maybe you will watch in horror as the iPhone and Android along with some help from Nokia overseas takes more and more market share from Windows Mobile. If you want to defend Windows Mobile I will let you sink all on your own here. Even Steve Ballmer claimed in 2006 that RIM would not overtake WM and said it again in 2007 about the iPhone. HE WAS WRONG BOTH TIMES.
I think most BB users would even agree it is a terrible device that already lost to RIM.
See the iPhone is better without hacking anything. But jail-breaking an iPhone easy, even YOU could probably do it, if you had one.
I own a BB and Windows Mobile (and a Nokia). If any of what you claim here was true I would have said it. I just am pointing to facts, not my task to convert anyone.
People buy certain devices for different reasons – sometimes their company hands them one. The BB is a decent business tool that will have an uphill battle against the iPhone and Android among consumers which is a huge market.
Apple has made the iPhone capable for both consumer and business. RIM has to go some, add better gaming, better UI and lots of other stuff into the Storm to compete in the consumer market. Having no WiFi and a lesser UI is not yet a great start.
Choice is a great thing it improves all the devices even the ones YOU do not use. Unfortunately, YOUR plumber VZW has greatly limited YOUR choice by refusing innovative devices. If they continue to do this they will lose more customers. Gee, they may even lose YOU one day. What will they do then?
If you have no more compelling arguments and just want insult me and ALL the readers intelligence we probably will not make 300, your somehow important goal you have set for yourself. I am getting bored of YOU as you have lacked anything worthwhile. See I read these blogs to gain knowledge and YOU have brought little! You even change your story from post to post. This is called spinning.
Great news if you have WiFi:
AT&T is now buying Wayport.
With this acquisition, AT&T will increase its total Wi-Fi network to about 80,000 locations worldwide, 20,000 of which will be in the United States.
“We’re seeing exponential growth of Wi-Fi-enabled devices, such as smartphones, combined with a continued dependency on 24-7, anytime, anywhere Internet access across business and consumer market segments,” John Stankey, chief executive of operations for AT&T, said in a statement.
Sorry Storm and VZW customers!
Wayport, huh.
I can see the ads…
Can’t connect to AT&T’s 3G network? No problem…stop on in to McDonalds, chow down some artery clogging Big Mac’s and connect. Or, you can drive to your local airport for additional access. Perhaps rent a hotel room for a more comfortable atmosphere.
AT&T…the nations largest 3G network.*
* This network includes cell towers, wifi, sonar, cups and string, morse code (for text messaging), UHF, UFO’s, WiMax (not ours, but who reads the fine print) and anything else that would be qualified as a ‘network’.
Sorry, I couldn’t resist. Obviously this is a stretch of exaggeration, but I just had to in light of #21+ chromo up above.
@ bluehorseshoe:
Sounds like you are a bit jealous as you do not have any WiFi.
Tell us bluehorseshoe the so smart guy is VZW Union? Where is there HQ? IS it in Manhattan? Seems you lost that argument with the simple facts.
Just think all of those hotspots (free to AT&T customers) are all faster than any of VZW 3G anywhere!
I thought you said WiFi was dead. Seems not.