T-Mobile G1 POP3/IMAP email? Not so good.
Word is out on the T-Mobile forums that POP3/IMAP email on the G1 is a big fail. People are reporting that they experience connection errors 95% of the time they check their email, email is not sending or sending as null, and forget about receiving — not happening. The problem looks to be across the board and is not tied any single email provider. Some people report that resetting the phone will re-establish the email connection for a single time before it fails again. Not surprisingly, Gmail is reported to be working just fine. A T-Mobile representative has responded on the forum and said that “This is being reported” and “will be researched with a high priority.” He also noted that this is not the first time they have seen a similar problem,
“We used to see similar errors and symptoms with the old MyEmail service and the new Consumer Email Client. Those are found on regular phones, but do encounter issues when there are more than 100 e-mails on the POP server or when there are emails with relatively large attachments.”
He asked any G1 user with email issues for additional information to help T-Mobile troubleshoot this problem. Starting off with glitches in a major feature like email is not good and a lot of hate will be poured upon T-Mobile is they don’t resolve this issue quickly. We know that several BGR readers out there are rocking G1’s, so what’s the deal with your email? Does it work or is it major fail? Chime in and let us know. Ours is as shady as a dark alley in Pakistan…
Thanks, Kyle!
@oldbluebox
hello, did you even read the T-Mobile forum that I referenced in my post..all 9 pages of it…Did you even read what a “T-Mobile representative” and not some joe off the street said about the POP3/IMAP problem? “I’ve brought this issue up on this morning’s meeting. This is being reported across the board and will be researched with a high priority.”
so from our responses, it looks like not everyone is having the problem which is why I threw it out there and asked for people to chime in….to find out more about this issue..
but you have to admit a 90 post thread in 3 days at the T-Mobile forum indicates that at least some people are having issues….
@ BG
I switched from a BlackBerry Curve to the G1. No regrets at all. Gotta be honest, I loved your site but all this fuss over the G1 is a huge turn off for me.
In response to the call for people who have switched from iphone or blackberry, I was let down when I switched from my blackberry to iphone. But it’s hard to completely fault the phone since the ATT service was so bad that the phone never really had a chance.
When I switched back to T-Mobile I temporarily went back to my BB and as of this week, have a G1. Really the only thing I miss about my BB was being able to view office docs. But in reality, I didn’t use that very often because it was kind of a pain in the butt.
As for everything else: email, browsing, texting, entertainment, call quality, the G1 wins hands down. There are some improvements I’d love to see, but I could say that about almost any product I’ve ever owned. The beauty of the G1, is I can actually hope to see most of them.
Maybe compared to a sleek iphone, it’s a little bulky looking, but stand it next to a blackberry curve and it looks pretty sleek itself. I’ll give it to Apple though, they make pretty products. But I prefer the promise of function and growth.
I love the ease of transferring music back and forth to my computer with this thing too. Never run into the problems I had with itunes. And will be happy to never have to use itunes again. Sold my ipod touch.
I’m not a developer or hardcore geek, and the G1 is easy and intuitive to use. Anyone claiming it’s not has never even touched one. My 10 year old niece picked it up and found her way around on it easily as well.
Not perfect, but not buggy. Also someone mentioned missing being notified automatically of email. With the proper settings, the G1 does this too. So far I’m not tempted at all to go back to my BB. Not hating on the BB, it served its purpose for a long time and was a great tool.
As with all of these devices, I’d love most of all to see them find a way to extend battery life.
@Kelly
9 pages of complaints and half are from the same people just multi posting.
Headline is still there. And i’ve yet to see a comment from a single person in this 50+ comment thread complaining about the email.
Again, from such a small source that’s an awfully big headline to run with.
Very lame post.
BG is going to lose readers with this kind of stuff.
This place is turning into Fox News.
Lol flamers these days. Remove Iphone fans from the world and half the hate would be gone. I heard the phones really cool. Even g4 gave it a good review.
I second ChrisMitch. My g1 chirps at me when I get an e-mail and the led light blinks.
On the various posts about the G1 I have noticed a lot of people saying that it is ok for BG to be biased. I agree that everyone has a natural bias but to be a good and useful reviewer I think a person should try to be fair. And when I got my G1 and noticed that many of the negative things that were said about the phone were just not true, like this, the usefulness and creditability of this site went way down for me.
No one is saying this phone is perfect, but you have to admit that there are so many exciting things about it and the fact that every headline here is negative is just a joke. BG, I have been a very loyal reader and I am a huge blackberry fan but this is getting ridiculous. The bottom line is, there are things I didn’t like about my blackberry. Small, unimportant annoyances. But now I have already experienced being annoyed by something and *gasp* changing it instantly on my G1! Pretty cool.
We have three G1’s; some IMAP (such as MIT) working well, particularly with SSL. Others (couple of work accounts) not working at all; won’t work with wildcard SSL certificate, won’t connect at all without it. So not usable at the moment. And it’s not a connectivity issue; applies whether on business network, university network, T-Mobile HotSpot, EDGE or 3G (of which there’s not much here in Massachusetts)
I write for various tech blogs, including PhoneReport.info, Android-Freak.org, and Symbian-Freak.com. I’ve never seen such journalistic irresponsibility. The BGR site has blasted the G1 and Android platform unnecessarily, and lauded the iPhone unwarrantedly. They bash T-MobileUSA while they win awards and set the standard for GSM service in America, while they celebrate at&t and their shoddy services. BGR seems to be the hired hand of someone with an agenda of swaying sales instead of informing readers.
The G1 is a smartphone. The iPhone is a featurephone with an SDK. They shouldn’t be compared. They’re both fine phones for completely different markets and needs. A smartphone always does more than a featurephone. Not always easier, but more.
If easy is your thing, go iPhone. If you want more functionality, go Android, Symbian S60, my preference, RIM, WinMo, Alp, or any other smartphone platform. Don’t allow unscrupulous “journalists” to spew propaganda and damage a company’s image. Do the research, and try reading other sites for a real objective opinion.
Anyone can flood forums with fake reports, and report it on blogs to bolster the regular hatred towards anything not Apple made. Luckily real G1 users quelled most of the early alarm.
Be careful of what writers you trust. I’m beginning to lose all my trust in the BGR staff. I should’ve known when they prefer the iPhone, while the GLOBE chose the N95 models in exponentially greater numbers that shatter the iPhone sales figures, and say the only relevant smartphone OS’s are RIM and the iPhone (which isn’t a smartphone. Smartphones multitask!), while dismissing Symbian, the world’s best selling, most ubiquitous, dominant mobile OS by far.
Here’s my report:
These boys ain’t so genius after all.
‘Christexaport’ – please provide some sort of cogent explanation of why you really think the iPhone is *not* a smartphone, but rather ‘a featurephone with an SDK’ and why it shouldn’t be compared with the G1. The simple reality is that by any meaningful definition the iPhone is a smartphone (that’s certainly how its competitors see it, and how customers evaluate it) and a head-to-head competitor with the G1, various BlackBerry’s and some Symbian S60 phones.
While the N95 was successful worldwide this is *not* exponentially greater numbers than the iPhone, yes more but not *exponentially* more, and it’s been available for longer and with much wider global distribution, both geographically and across multiple operators in many geographies.
FWIW ‘easy’ is essential to make functionality useful; just try browsing on the N95 for example (where the iPhone rocks), messaging (where BlackBerry’s rock) or buying a worthwhile application; Symbian apps are hard to get hold off, much more expensive *and tied to a specific phone, through the IMEI*.
And, BTW, is there actually any significant ALP phone shipping yet? I see the i800 was canceled, and the best thing I can see now is a rumour of a possible launch by a no-name company in Russia. What’s the ALP device that either you’re using, or is available…
It’s ridiculous to pick a single aspect – multi-tasking – and use that as the basis of defining a smart phone.
@christexaport
before you let your mouth runneth over maybe you should do some research yourself before you malign BGR and boast about yourself. Please show me where in this article I say the G1 is garbage and the iPhone is better? I dont even use the word iPhone once.
Lol, T-Mobile sets the standard for GSM service in America. That comment shows that you have no clue. T-Mobile is just rolling out 3G now while AT&T is already planning for LTE. look at their coverage map, T-Mobile is poor compared to AT&T. I cant even use the G1 because I live in area that does not have T-Mobile coverage! I live a little over an hour outside of Boston, hardly a rural area, and they cant even extend their service out that far. T-Mobile may have better plans and better customer service but their GSM/3G network is not even close to AT&T.
And the iPhone is a feature phone with an SDK and shouldnt be considered a smartphone because it has less features? Lol, if that isn’t propaganda, then I don’t what is. If you use your criteria “it has less features” as the benchmark for whether a phone is a smartphone or not, then your G1 is in trouble. According to your self-created standards, the G1 would not be a smartphone because it is missing stereo bluetooth, BT tethering, Exchange support, and video capture.
Did you even read my article? Did you look at where I said the dissent was coming from, and consider why I asked everyone to comment? I wrote “Word is out on the T-Mobile forums that POP3/IMAP email on the G1 is a big fail.” I said the source was the T-Mobile forums and not around the world. Right then and there you should have known we were dealing with a single forum and not worldwide opinion. For you to extend that beyond the scope of that forum and claim that we hate the G1 is a gross misinterpretation of my post. As far as people flooding it with fake reports, give me a break. So all those people are nefarious and the T-Mobile representative was lying too, just for us so we could get a story. Are you delusional? Mind if I post your response on that forum and let them comment?
I also ask at the end “so what’s the deal with your email? Does it work or is it major fail? Chime in and let us know.” I am asking our readers to confirm or debunk the problems other people are seeing. If I wanted this article to be about the T-Mobile forum and their negative opinions only, then I would not have asked for other people’s opinions.
Lastly, do your homework and don’t try to be so “witty” at the end. I am not a boy and don’t call me one.
The pop3 for me is DISASTEROUS. I own the phone, so I’m not just stating negative items for the sake of downing the phone. I am NOT a Mac / Apple liker or lover. In fact, don’t own any mac products so I’m biased TOWARD this phone. But i’ve had nothing but problems since the day I bought it. I have comcast. Called the company to ensure i had the correct server ports, etc. Set it up correctly and made sure all messages stayed on the server. Got 1 email. Then nothing. But when I looked on my comcast account, 10 messages were there.
Reset the G1, tried again. Again, one msg came through. Nothing else.
Also, whenever I try using other features that require web cnxn (utube, internet, etc.), i constantly lose my connection or get a connection error msg.
I’m trying to be patient, but right now, this phone isn’t cutting it!
couldn’t agree more.
while i did not have the sidekick, i did have the dash (so, for the record, i’m a non-mac fan AND a t-mobile fan).
i am returning the G1 today b/c i can’t get simple email.
while the windows mobile os is not the best, i was able to connect to all of my pop3 accounts instantly with NO probs.
i too understand that new items have glitches. but these g1 glitches are significant, particularly for my needs: email. i’m not looking for exchange support. i’ve lived w/out and can continue to do so. but yeesh, unless i just have a lemon of a phone, i can’t see how everyone is doing so well.
I have four pop accounts and gmail and it has been working very well. Actually works better than any WinMo device I have used and I have been used by quite a few.
No problems here. Been using pop email on it since the 17th without incident.
After reading through the responses, I thought I would add another couple of cents to this out of control discussion. Some people have said that the email on their G1 is working perfectly (including mine). Other people have stated that they couldn’t get pop to work at all. So what are these reports saying? That some people know how to set up POP and IMAP and some people don’t? Or does it mean Google’s email protocol is only compatible with certain servers?
There is one thing I think we can agree on, and that is that Gmail works great on the G1. So to all those people that have given up so easily and are ready to take their G1 back to the store…have any of you tried using your Gmail account to access your other email accounts? Gmail is setup perfectly to be used as an email gateway, with the capability to retrieve mail from any number of outside mail accounts, filter for spam and viruses and send out outgoing mail as any sender you wish. The actual user@gmail.com account never even has to be used.
So how about you guys swallowing a bit of humble pie and ask for some help. I’m more than happy to help anyone who wants to keep their shiny new G1.
AJ McLachlan – your assessment of the size of the problem is correct; some POP3 and IMAP4 accounts work, unfortunately many don’t. It’s not user error; it’s some quirk in the Mail client as the same settings work on other devices. YMMV, some of my IMAP4 accounts work, others don’t.
The work around of using Gmail is not a complete solution however:
1 you can’t actually manage e-mail (move, delete) in the accounts forwarded to your Gmail account – this involves duplicate effort
2 the Gmail client on the G1 does not allow you to send from any account; it only sends from the default account
3 worse, even with the ‘Reply from account sent to’ flag set in Gmail, it still only replies from the default account
It works to read, but even then does not update read status on the other IMAP4 servers. It doesn’t manage, it doesn’t reply properly and it requires at a minimum twice the e-mail management effort.
I’d love you to solve my problem; I’ve been monitoring the T-Mobile boards and there’s no viable workaround that we’ve got working. The proposed ‘Use TLS when available’ workaround to cope with SSL certificate issues doesn’t work either.
Any suggestions?
@ Michael Davies,
Thanks for such an intelligent reply. You make alot of points, but allow me to explain myself.
The advent of smartphones is born of something specific. Being able to install applications or play music are not enough to make a device a smartphone. Most basic cellphones today can access the internet (WAP), install apps (Java midlets), and open music, video, and image files.
The true birth of the smartphone began when mobile device began to behave as stationary computers. They allowed custom and third party applications to be installed by the user, gave those applications full system access, utilizing true multitasking computing platforms to allow apps to work in concert.
THIS development led to the smartphone moniker and definition, such that a smartphone is:
“Any portable device that’s main full-time purpose is voice communication, allows the self creation and installation of third party software with full system access, and presents a desktop like hardware computing platform.”
Now that means the iPhone nearly pulls off the feat! It IS a portable device meant mainly for voice communications, but the rest is merely similar enough to a smartphone to make less tech savvy users feel as if they’re using a smartphone.
For instance, the iPhone allows self creation of applications, but not self installation, forcing users to go through the App Store process. And being able to officially only install Apps from the App Store means the apps aren’t truly third party, but Apple submitted. A smartphone allows innovation, and should never remove the ability to install a custom app, as Apple intends by blocking distribution of competitive apps. You can’t improve the default experience of an iPhone without breaching your license agreement. Software is, in essence, only provided by Apple.
Also, allowing apps to access all parts of the OS and pull data from other applications is essential. Apple’s iPhone distinctly blocks this, and stymies the otherwise great device. Only default applications share data, and none work parallell in concert, only working in series. So though the computing hardware is there, the iPhone is banned from utilizing it. Despite a fast processor and memory, only one app can be run at once, and they all work in a walled environment, sharing no resources or data. The API’s are all sectioned off from each other. This is nothing like PC’s today, and not how smartphones have come to be defined today.
So a featurephone is a device which has its features defined or edited by the manufacturer’s approval only. A smartphone has its features defined by the user at will, limited only by desire and ability to develop applications. There is limitless potential, whereas the iPhone is the epitome of limitation.
Some online journalist may call it a smartphone, but journalists aren’t always the most tech savvy individuals, better at writing than teaching tech. Its wise to market to consumer perception, so the iPhone is still a competitor. Its simple interface and great features are more than enough for most, and give it mass appeal.
The iPhone was sold globally. The N95 had no US marketing or penetration whatsoever. I dare say the iPhone is much more widely marketed and available. Outside the US, 2007’s N95 is considered the king of the smartphone, still compared to new devices as the benchmark for media savvy smartphones. The feature set of the iPhone is nice, but pales in comparison to the N95. Most of the BGR don’t even mention it as the premier device of the world, only giving RIM and Apple love, but no device has been more popular the last 2 years. Had it had carrier support in America, the iPhone and Blackberry’s US success may have been greatly minimized.
Easy IS essential to functionality in the iPhone, but some platforms go another route. Much like Digidesign ProTools recording software, S60 is feature packed, and is designed for complete user control and configurability. Learning the OS isn’t any harder than Windows XP, and just like ProTools, S60 allows functions no other platform can offer. When looking at the iPhone, it doesn’t intend to do much more than its intended purpose, whereas S60 devices are computers to use as you please.
Funny you ask me to browse the web on the N95. I only browse using the N95-2. I don’t use desktop computers, and the S60 browser sets the benchmark for mobile browsing. 90% of the web is just like on your desktop PC. The iPhone browser is for LOOKING at the web. The N95 is for USING the web. Videos always work, web apps usually work, you don’t need custom MySpace, Facebook, or YouTube apps, and Flash content is just like a desktop. If I need simple and fast page renders without Flash, I use Opera Mini, which is a free app that is exactly like the iPhone browser, but not nearly as capable. The Nokia Webkit browsing advantage is CLEARLY in my favor over a non-Flash enabled Apple Webkit browser. No comparison. As for messaging, the N95 trumps the iPhone as well. The iPhone’s messaging is trumped by the 2004 Motorola Razr, which allows MMS messaging. The Blackberry does email well, but so does the N95, even doing PUSH and Exchange email. The Blackberry’s email interface is better, but the N95 is better in all other aspects.
I don’t know what’s so hard about buying S60 apps. Googling “buy S60 apps” lists various sites for acquiring S60 apps. And you rarely have to buy them, as most of the top apps are freeware anyway. Every Symbian S60 web portal is full of links to application sites, plus the devices feature an app delivery service, though users prefer to search on their own instead of a provider controlled listing.
Symbian apps are easy to find, usually free, and always fully accessing the system. I have over 114 apps installed on my device, and regularly run 20 or more at once. (I’m currently running 17 apps, including this web browser!). Apps being locked to one device is called piracy protections. Most apps aren’t this way, but some require it per the user agreement at the developer’s request. Many will allow you to transfer your license if changing devices.
@ Kelly Hodgkins,
Don’t take my post as boastful. Please understand my characterization of bias wasn’t pointed directly at you. Your article was a simple report of a fact. Good work! But as a site, you’ll have to admit the coverage of the iPhone and G1 is very colored, and BGR takes all opportunity to blast the G1, but praise the iPhone. I love debunking the iPhone myth, but only do so on a Symbian dedicated site. My views on PhoneReport are more objective by design, since its intended as an information site. Many want to know the good AND bad of the G1. With the iPhone’s litany of downfalls, I’d expect as many bad reports, but only see the slant towards blasting the Android and the G1. This is just an outside observation. BGR will survive either way, but more objectivity would go a long way in its advancement.
IN NO WAY DO I FEEL YOU POSTED FALSE REPORTS. I merely want to point out that that has happened before, and as a member of the forum, know things like that happen, oddly at the hands of iPhone zealots. Everything in a forum isn’t always accurate, and just a collection of people with an obviously serious issue. Fortunately, it turns out the issue isn’t as widespread as initially thought. It may be a local or server issue. Nothing has been clear so far.
BGR used to be the place for information, but lately the bias makes me second guess whether a fully objective view is being given. I only suggest you and your colleagues realize slanting in a particular direction may build your large iPhone user readership, but advanced smartphone OS users will feel as if you don’t recognize the advantage of a less simple device, which obviously many people need and want. It will only push readers to other more objective sites.
As far as the T-Mobile vs. at&t issue, the J.D.Powers surveys speak for themselves. T-Mobile has remained number 1 or 2 in all categories. Their 3G network has existed largely since 2006, but can’t be used until the Department of Defense releases the frequency for their use. Once the entire network is online, you’ll see they have nationwide coverage with few gaps.
Capacity issues and network gaps have plagued at&t, slowing the deployment of data intensive devices. Speed is ok, but without capacity, users never see those speeds. T-Mobile’s way of doing business has equalled better service and coverage for quite some time. Compare 3G speeds in densely populated areas for proof. And this is without T-Mobile even having optimized their network.
With T-Mobile leading the Android brigade, their profile amongst the two national GSM carriers will soon be raised. We won’t see LTE for years, and T-Mobile can deploy both if necessary, just as carriers did with EDGE to 3G evolutions. Being first isn’t always best. Being best performing can be a factor as more people depend on the connection. My opinion of them being best is subjective, but at least based on sound data and well chronicled facts.
By the way, you CAN use the G1 in your area, only at EDGE speeds. Many users use it in this fashion today. I live in Arlington, Texas, not far from the Dallas Telecom Corridor, in a major metropolitan area. We have 3G far out into the suburban areas. It will vary, but the network has grown alot since its launch weeks ago. I assume the Boston market will get similar focus in no time. You may be well served to go to a T-Mobile corporate location, or read the online information, and try the device for yourself. I’m waiting for my test device as we speak, since I wasn’t willing to buy such an expensive secondary device.
My analysis is far from propaganda, nor self created. The creators of the term bore the standard. The G1 has features missing, but you, I, or anyone else with the motivation to try can create them, or submit requests to the developer community and watch them come to fruition. This is the main feature of Android, inherent of its open source nature and vast developer community.
I wasn’t referring to you as a “boy”, but your staff and site, the “Boy” Genius Report. It was really just a jab and play on words. No disrespect intended, but I guess I would’ve been offended, too. My bad. To be considered genius, I assumed you’d prefer the most features, but your staff’s preferences tend closer to simplicity and less functionality. The iPhone is called “the simple to use device”. The S60 platform is described as “for geeks”. Aren’t most geniuses geeks? Most pilots I know can fly a Cessna, but would prefer the chance to fly a fighter jet. Being good is ok, but being a virtuoso is another thing.
We all have our own likes. But I’m a real genius, IQ of 152. I myself want more functions and power, and I find S60 just as intuitive as my 13 year old niece, who’s mastered the S60 UI. But not all geniuses like alike, so there’s nothing wrong with preferring anything you like for your own purpose.
I have alot of smartphone resources you may wish to research for yourself. I found it very enlightening. I’ll be glad to show you more about smartphones, Android, and Symbian, if you like. Just email me at christexaport@sbcglobal.net.
I have a G1 and love it. But then again I’m not a tech kinda guy. I see all this talk about the email. I have no problem with my yahoo email. I tried to set up my work email and got a error code that could not connect to server. Can any one help fix that problem???
@Davies, you should seek a solution to the email issue on Android developer forums. The talent there could easily start diagnosing and resolving your issue. Many are members of AndroidCommunity.com and Android-Freak.org.
@ richard, contact your job’s network administrator. It may be an enterprise mail system, like Exchange, which requires special software capabilities Android hasn’t implemented yet. There is a solution in the works.
@Christaexport:
Your definition of what a smartphone is both idiosyncratic, and sadly out of date:
1 WAP is *not* access to the Internet, and falls woefully short of any credible benchmark for a smartphone
2 Java midlets are not *native* apps, their access to ‘phone resources is too constrained and the implementation of JSRs is so incomplete and inconsistent as to make them in general of limited use at best
FWIW, given the criteria of install apps, with full system access and enable multi-tasking, the iPhone is a smartphone.
It’s Unix under the hood. That’s got to meet the definition of a computer class operating system.
You say ‘led to the definition’ – source? Citation? Rationale? This is where you go off the rails, by making several unsupported assertions:
A main full-time purpose is voice communication – not necessarily at all – that’s *not* the purpose of most BlackBerry’s, and by your own admission they’re smartphones… just for one example
B there is not any widely accepted or established requirement that anyone can create and install any app without any constraints – that’s a *very* open smartphone, but it’s still a smartphone, even if there are constraints (such as the App Store imposes) on exactly which apps you can install – the iPhone’s a smartphone, albeit one with some limitations on application installation, but that does *not* disqualify it – and FWIW Symbian with its signing model also imposes significant constraints on which apps can be installed
C it’s nonsense to suggest that because Apple distributes 3rd party apps they’re not 3rd party apps – is an app only an app if I get it direct from the software vendor, and install it without any third party intervention? No, that’s just a question of business models. I think you’re clutching at straws here, and distorting the plain meaning of the word ‘providing’ in a tendentious way
Yes, the iPhone’s most significant current limitation is that it does not well support running applications in background or multiple *user installed* applications at once. There are in fact several apps running at once, just not several *user installed* apps. The ‘phone, SMS, calendar, clock, e-mail and iPod apps are all active, providing alerts as appropriate.
FWIW, this is the area where the Android G1 is strongest, and the iPhone weakest amongst the principal competing smartphone platforms.
I could not disagree more strongly with your purported definition of smartphone; this is a distorted reality. You’re artificially constraining the definition of a smartphone to being an ‘open smartphone’, and even this definition would disqualify Symbian because of the frequent inability to transfer paid apps to a new device.
FWIW, the constraints of WinMo imposed by Microsoft would make all WinMo phones by your definition no more than ‘feature phones’; clearly absurd, or BillG is out several hundred million dollars for another feature phone platform.
Openness, which you focus on is an aspect, an important aspect, but not the only aspect nor the qualifying criterion.
I’m *not* an online journalist; I teach tech at MIT and at London Business School, and I’ve been working with smartphones since the Newton was hooked up to the Nokia 2110 at my behest, and my then company worked with Nokia on the very first Communicator in the mid-90’s.
The iPhone is succesful because it’s easy to use, and does key smartphone tasks like browsing and playing media much better than any other device. BlackBerry’s still kick ass when it comes to communication and coordination. The unfortunate reality is the the capabilities of both WinMo and Symbian devices are deeply compromised by their user interface. WinMo’s browser? The two-handed and fiddly stylus that you often have to resort to? The IMAP4 e-mail client on the E71?
The simple facts are that originally the iPhone was *not* sold globally, and its global footprint expanded much later than the launch of the N95. In the US, the N95 lacked marketing support and traction, while RoW the N95 had much wider distribution and much greater support, while the iPhone was still being rolled out.
When you focus on ‘feature set’ you’re missing the point. If a ‘feature’ is difficult to use, then it doesn’t matter. The data on user behaviour tells the truth; iPhone users browse more, use e-mail more, upload and download photos more and (of course) do much more with music than N95 users. Ease of use transforms the customer experience.
And it’s sad if Windows XP is your chosen benchmark for usability:
- first, neither WinMo nor Symbian match the Windows XP experience, lacking a large screen, multiple windows, a responsive mouse and in many cases (such as the N95) a full keyboard – compare with the endless clicking involved and multi-tap entry on the N95 to the multi-touch of the iPhone or the menu/trackball/click/back of the BlackBerry
- second, it’s a *mobile* device, hand held with a small screen – the UI must transcend these limitations to be effective
- third, if you only browse using the N95-2 browser you’re really missing out – we’ve been doing back-to-back comparisons amongst N95 8GB, E71, E90, X1, iPhone, Treo Pro, Curve, and Bold amongst others – the iPhone and Bold are streets ahead of the others, and the E71 only becomes competitive with the Skyfire beta
- fourth, MMS messaging is not critical – very few use it – and you’re on crack if you think the RAZR has good messaging – have you actually ever used one? It sucked! #1 for messaging, BlackBerry by a long way; #2 iPhone; #3 and coming up strong (particulary if you can just rely on the cloud) the G1
Try actually buying an S60 app from an S60 device. We ran some back-to-back comparisons, and it took several times as long to buy apps, they cost a great deal more, installation was more difficult (I ask you *#06# for the IMEI…) and *paid apps are locked to the phone*.
Come one, you’re all about ‘openness’; how on earth do you reconcile that with app locking? Although some will allow you to transfer your license if you change devices, it’s at their discretion. Hmmm.
Three key criteria for apps: available; accessible; and affordable.
A natural experiment; if the App Store’s such bad idea, why are RIM and Google rushing to emulate it?
While you may have installed hundreds of apps, that puts you way outside the norm. Most other smartphone users don’t, and to the extent that they do, iPhone users and BlackBerry users do it much more often.
It’s not just about the technology, or arbitrary definitions of the business model. It’s about what customers want, and how they behave. By those simple criterion, the iPhone and BlackBerry’s and G1 and WinMo and Symbian devices are all smartphones.
Methink you doth protest too much.
Last but by no means least; there is no solution on the Android developer forums for our G1 issues; the proposed work arounds don’t work either. This is a classical usability issue; why should I have to be trawling *developer* forums to try and get my e-mail to work…
IMAP has problems. The big ones for me:
1. can’t create/delete folders
2. can’t move message to another folder
3. delete message not reflected on server
4. can’t sort/filter
5. oldest messages display first, making it useless for large folders
6. urls/addresses/phone numbers aren’t clickable (but full links are)
you can’t see beyond your stars, Michael. I’m shocked such a wise man is so clueless. Just google “why the iPhone is not a smartphone”, “what is a smartphone”, or “smartdreaming definition of a smartphone” for more insight.
The best mobile browsers are… RIM and iPhone?? No Flash, on Silverlight, no animations, no web apps… You just like to dispute anything you disagree with, because that was the most foolish opinion ever heard! If the iPhone browser is best, shouldn’t Opera Mini be a close second? They’re practically identical! And S60 users prefer the default browser to Skyfire big time! You’re just out of touch when it comes to more advanced mobile browsing and web computing.
I’ll leave this worthless discussion to John McCain and the rest of the clueless idiots we call experts in this country. I’m a big fan of MIT, and actually applied as a teen, but was too poor to attend. I hope the faculty is more diverse, because some people shouldn’t be trusted with dispensing education they should still probably be seeking themselves. They may have the job and the credentials, but I’d stick to real experts with advanced expertise that can figure out a consumer grade device kids use in this case.
At least you didn’t call yourself a techie or a geek. That’s what my associates are. We’d be offended. Good luck with the genius act, guys. You’ll need more than wit and the King’s English to pull it off. I’m not convinced.
Not all sites are created equally, nor analysts…
And while avoiding comparing the iPhone OS and features by comparing S60 and WinMo to a desktop OS, you showed one thing. Smartphone OS do compare, though not always favorably, with similar functions. The iPhone is nowhere in the discussion. Featurephones need not apply. This is a computing discussion, not a device discussion. Had the iPhone, or bgrPhone, been left out, it may have stayed that way.
Been turned on to the BGR website by a few friends over the past month… however, I have to be honest – this particular article was a real turn off.
I work for a organization that tries to cut through political punditry and other nonsense, and I have to admit – this “blurb” was neither well thought out or executed, and your “excuse” for why you published this in the first place still makes you sound like you’re getting paid to downplay the device.
That said, I have all three: G1, iPhone 3G, and BB, and I think that JaggedXJ has hit this comparison more on the mark than anyone… On top of which, he gave me a GREAT laugh in the process!
Kudos to JaggedXJ!